• JoshTheStoner
    2
    Thanks for the advice. I have decided to purchase a Veco tank based on your feedback. While at my local vape shop, a fellow toker recommended a 20 dollar cart/battery combo that he uses. He even let me use his and i was immediately impressed. It hit much harder and also uses the ss316 0.5 ohm coils. I had fantastic results the first day, but the coil burned out quickly. I figured that i hadn't added enough fluid directly to the coil upon installation. I purchased more and they work flawlessly for about a day. Then they start tasting burnt, but it doesnt affect the juice and it's easy to change with the tank full. The coil lifts up when the mouthpiece is unscrewed so changing it is easy. It also had adjustable airflow, but its an internal battery with a set 18w output. For 20 bucks though it will work fine until my Veco arrives. I think the reason the coils are burning so fast is bc I'm using rosin for my concentrate and i don't use filter bags. I'm relatively new to pressing my own rosin, but the potency and taste are out of this world and the product has great clarity. I can't see any visible plant matter left behind, but it's also possible i am not heating the blend enough to fully emulsify the concentrate. I bring a pot of water to 140°F, then remove it from the eye and add the vial with the blend. I let it soak in the hot water for 20 minutes. I monitor the temperature and stir it every few minutes. When i look at it through the light prior to filling the cart, the clarity is perfect with a golden amber tint. When I'm vaping it though, i can see through the tank window tiny globs of wax attaching to the outside of the coil. I'm thinking these may be getting drawn into the coil from the two intake ports on the bottom and clogging the flow and burning the coil out. The liquid otherwise remains the same color and clarity. Are there any suggestions to improving my mixing process? Thanks again to all who have contributed to this thread, especially Art. This information has been very useful to me and i assume many others. Together we can master the techniques and products to acheive the best end result. Happy vaping!
  • artv4nd3l4y
    925

    These questions don't have any one right answer, but I'll try to be helpful.

    The distillate is so thick, I don’t want to put it in something like a vile and not be able to extract it with the syringe I have.bkrieger

    This is the same thing with shatter, even the largest 14 gauge needle tip syringe will have difficulty pulling up pure shatter. However when you add terpenes, it makes the viscosity thinner so it can be easier to use a syringe.

    Also, would the distillate/terpines need to be heated up like the shatter?bkrieger

    I haven't worked with pure distillate, but my guess is heat will be necessary. I have found that decarboxylation repeatably prevents separation, and before I discovered that Connoissuer Concentrates would separate because I wasn't using enough heat. When I figured out the right amount of heat, it no longer would separate, I don't think it would be different with distillate. For CC you need around 140F of heat, anything higher can vaporize the terpenes themselves.

    Lastly, how much terpines should be added to 1g of distillate?bkrieger

    My opinion is the less the better, it's hard to say but with shatter I use .4ml to 1 gram. Since CCell cartridges are made for pure distillate, you should have good results with less, the only problem you would run into is the liquid being too thick for the syringe. This may be another reason you need more terpenes added to make it thinner. Another good point to remember is with terpene solutions, generally the more you add the worse it will taste. I've found mixes with .2ml to taste great (better than Brass Knuckles prefilled), however the solution can grain out after a couple days if you don't use it quickly. There's some trial and error with mixing terpenes, it's surprisingly complicated to make a good solution, I would start low and work your way up.
  • bkrieger
    55
    @artv4nd3l4y
    Thank You so much for that detailed explanation.

    I will try mixing the distillate the same method I use shatter then, which is the shot glass method in water on low heat. The temp just barely reaches 140 F. I’ll just use less terpines. I tend to use not enough terpines and the mixture comes out thick and I usually have to add more. I still haven’t gotten it totally down, because usually make it too thick, and lost some of fhe final mix stuck on the bottom of the shot glass. I still usually have enough to fill a cartridge, so I would say it has been a success.

    Question, what method are you using to measure the amount of terpines you are adding. I had purchased a cheap syringe with numbers down to .2 just for measuring, but it is not very good. I have tried figuring out how many drops for ml to use, but I’m not 100% sure if I’ve been accurate.

    Again, thanks for all your help and posts detailing everything needed. Much appreciated. @artv4nd3l4y.
  • artv4nd3l4y
    925
    Question, what method are you using to measure the amount of terpines you are adding.bkrieger

    I use the smallest syringe available, measuring down to .1ml increments, but I still find it to not be that accurate in general although close enough. The rubber itself can vary when it gets shifted, it's hard to explain but syringes are definitely not that accurate. Now drops if you ask google, will tell you they are .05ml, but I've found different gauge syringe needles have different visible drop sizes for sure.

    One thing I would say about drops is it can be an effective way to repeat a specific amount, but of course you must use the same syringe/needle sizes each time. Pipettes are definitely the best way to measure precisely, but they are not cheap for quality ones that guarantee accuracy. You can get them for around $50-60 on Amazon, but there are many mixed reviews for the cheaper ones.

    Good pipettes can range anywhere from $150-300 but from what I looked into, the cost doesn't seem to be worth it when you can use other methods. One thing to consider though, is if a $60 pipette worked well enough which I think it would, it will eventually save cost on syringes. i.e. 500 tips of 1ml pipette tips are under $20... Syringes are more expensive in the long run since you have to replace the entire thing.
  • bkrieger
    55
    @artv4nd3l4y
    I do have the small syringes that go down to .1, but sometimes when I pull the CC up, all the liquid does not come up into the syringe. Must be because they are cheap syringes.

    I have tried the cheap pipettes, and they just didn’t seem to work. It was tough to measure the amount.

    I may look into the $60 pipettes. Do you have a link to an example of this?

    Also, 1 more question. I have need using the Skywalker OG, which as you know is their flavorless terpines. I would like to try a flavored option. Have you been using any flavored CC terpines, and if so what would you recommend that is free of PG/VG?

    Thanks again
  • juxt
    977

    using syringes is a bit wasteful, if you notice how Drs/Nurses do it, they overfill the syringe then push out the overfill to be wasted. This clears air bubbles, but also it's how you get the accurate measure with the syringe. You will always end up leaving whatever amount of stuff in the needle itself unless it's sucked out the other end by capillary action.

    Cheap pipettes work a bit the same way, suck in a bit more than you want and just do the chef thing of winging it a little bit.

    I personally can't do any flavored terps...everything seems so chemically strong, even some of the flavorless brands are too harsh for me. My buddy had some Blue River that seemed really good, but I can't get them. The synergic naked or whatever line from Puff Magic is ok, better IMO than using skywalker from CC.
  • bkrieger
    55
    Thank You @juxt

    I know there’s no easy way to
    accurately measure. I’ll try the syringe method.

    I like the Skywalker OG, but I may try a different CC flavore. I haven’t tried Puff Magic, as I have heard other people prefer CC, and I do like it.

    Mod fixed tag
  • JoshTheStoner
    2
    Hey guys. So I am still having issues with my mixing process. Upon closer inspection, i found the mix was a little hazy and had very fine particles of the wax floating in it. At first glance, it looks clear and golden amber, but when i hold it very close to the light, i see the light haze and fine particulates. I believe this is what is causing my coils to burn out prematurely. I get around 0.5 ml vaped before the burnt taste returns and i need to swap the coil. I feel like i should up the heat during the mixing process bc it doesn't clear up when sitting in the 140° water, but i don't want to degrade the oil in any way. Any suggestions? Is 140° the max temp before thc and terpenes begin to breakdown? Is there another flaw in my mixing process? I bring the water to 150, then remove from the heat and prepare the mix. I add the mixture when the temp is 140 and allow it to sit in the water while i stir it frequently and maintain the water temp. After 20-30 minutes of stirring and seeing that it isn't mixing any further, i draw it up and install immediately in my cart. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

    Also as a side note, where do you purchase your ss316 0.5 ohm coils? Through the Vaporesso/vanguard smoke site? They have a shipping time of 21-35 days. Let me know if you have a better site with faster shipping. Thanks for all you guy's help.
  • juxt
    977

    Some people say you can go up to 170F before terpene loss...I never had to, but when you press rosin do it at 190F, so if you have to mix liquid at 170F to get a good mix I'd say do it.

    I have a local vape shop that carries the gold CCell heads for the Gemini ;) I do like http://elementvape.com I think they have the vaporesso atomizers and they sell the theiron that a lot of people here use.
  • artv4nd3l4y
    925

    The particles will definitely contribute to premature coil failure. Since the Veco is for e liquid only, the solution needs to be mixed as well as possible.

    There are two possible causes here:

    1. Not enough heat
    The murky/hazy look indicates there wasn't enough heat used. I found when I had separation issues, adding more heat prevented it from happening again, and I noticed the color was very clear after the heat as a result of decarboxylation. The heat is necessary to infuse them together, so the terpenes actually dissolve into the THC completely.

    According to the source below, there is only one terpene cannabigerol (CBG) that has a boiling point under 140F, it's 125.6F max. Other than that BCP is the only close one at 246.2F which is even higher than the highest recommended decarboxylation temperature. As you can see I believe you can get away with more heat, of course the less is better to avoid any unnecessary conversion of THC into CBN (just for anyone not aware, THC-A is converted into THC through the process of decarboxylation, further heat however can convert the activated form of THC into CBN). Also note this table only lists COMMON terpenes found in cannabis, since terpene manufacturers don't list their ingredients, it's possible there are other terpenes used not listed that could evaporate.
    http://vaporizertemp.com/components-cannabis-terpene-boiling-points-effects/

    2. Not mixing long enough
    20-30 minutes was not enough time for me to get the Connoissuer Concentrates solution fully mixed. It typically took around 2 hours to get mixed perfectly, which is a big reason for purchasing a magnetic hot plate to automate the process. That said, some heat will always be necessary, unfortunately the exact amount depends on the concentrate.
  • juxt
    977

    You just got this shit down bro. I respect your thoughts so much! Thank you.
  • artv4nd3l4y
    925

    Thanks juxt, and same to you!
  • JoshTheStoner
    2

    I second that whole heartedly! Thank you for sharing your findings. Your feedback has been extremely helpful.
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