• Hapo
    245
    ...most reputable merchants that do preorders don't charge your account until the item is shipped...
  • Xclerk
    10
    Hes doing a live stream now in insta maybe that will give some explaination
  • Baron23
    10.5k
    I don’t do Ryan.
  • The Rogue Wax Works
    1.2k
    @Baron23 this is just a guess and a shot in the dark but i get t he feeling that "you dont do Ryan"? :lol:
  • Baron23
    10.5k
    hahaha

    @Bud - you asked so...IMO...the majority of the posts on FC recently wrt Mi3 are negative to Ryan and his typical non-management management style.

    Then there are the party faithful defending him and RBT "cause he's only a one man shop" and "yeah, but these are artisanal and hand crafted vapes" which I love because these are being produced in China....by very deft artisanal Chinese hands.
  • Other Side
    1.4k
    ...most reputable merchants that do preorders don't charge your account until the item is shipped..Hapo

    Not sure I agree with that or it would defeat the purpose of a presale. But Ryan has done his fair share of presale's and his track record is sketchy at best. He finally delivered on Zion after years of fucking around. Then he took money for the Zion M and has not delivered that. And with that I can tell you that I saw this coming a mile away. When I saw the timeline for the Mi3 presale I was like, yeah right. And here we are. Coming up on two months late and no real definitive reason why (not sure I buy the screw and custom's wood issue).

    And while all this is going on Ryan has handed over the reigns to a college kid who is the next in line of people trying to "help" Ryan. Meanwhile Ryan has once again run from all obligations so he can take a tour of the Western United States.

    Man it's so sad to see this cycle continue. I hope that man starts to take accountability for the business and decisions he has made.
  • BestBuds
    2k
    Man it's so sad to see this cycle continue. I hope that man starts to take accountability for the business and decisions he has madeOther Side
    Haven't we said that a few years running now? :roll:
  • Terpenetime
    370
    Mi3 update from RBT on Instagram...

    ‘Shipping issues have been resolved. Estimated delivery to RBT 2/20. Orders made in 2019 should be sent by 3/1. Remaining orders by 3/21. Thanks for your patience. Prayers of good health for RBT team China’
  • PAM
    283
    odd that update comes after chinese holidays, sounds like they just left china or sumthing :yikes:
  • Gonzo
    427
    I thought they were sitting in customs.....did they get sent back to China? They should stick to one story.
  • SouthboundPachyderm
    2.4k
    30% off RBT right now using code "jahbless"... seems like "jobless" would be more appropriate. :razz:
  • PAM
    283
    jahbless
    job less
  • SouthboundPachyderm
    2.4k
    Is there an echo in here?
  • jqcj5
    104
    Looks like the Mi2’s are going for $135 shipped. That’s 50% off not 30%.
  • jqcj5
    104
    must have just been a snafu because now they're $185 shipped
  • Terpenetime
    370
    Looks like the Mi2’s are going for $135 shipped.jqcj5

    The main reason I cancelled my Mi3 order was concern about the efficacy of the ‘two screw’ solution to it’s heating issues. A secondary issue though was the level of ‘fire sale’ discounts being offered, which I felt was undermining the RBT brand and might have left me out of pocket if I’d wanted to move the Mi3 on, despite the pre-order discount.

    I don’t suppose RBT has any choice if he’s that desperate to generate cash flow but he should be aware that not everyone regards inordinately large discounts as good news.
  • LabPong
    3.6k
    The main reason I cancelled my Mi3 order was concern about the efficacy of the ‘two screw’ solution to it’s heating issues. A secondary issue though was the level of ‘fire sale’ discounts being offered, which I felt was undermining the RBT brand and might have left me out of pocket if I’d wanted to move the Mi3 on, despite the pre-order discount.

    I don’t suppose RBT has any choice if he’s that desperate to generate cash flow but he should be aware that not everyone regards inordinately large discounts as good news.
    Terpenetime

    And after reading tons of posts with people having problems with cracked glass and wood on the Splinters.....I think I did the right thing in the end. Will be interesting to see if this is going to be an issue with the chinese MI3.....I guess we will find out in the on coming weeks/months.
  • boze
    11
    It's odd to see everyone so ready to pile on RBT for the growing pains of spinning up Chinese manufacturing. For what it's worth, I use multiple Splinters daily, I'm happy to be on the Milaana 3 pre-order, and I ordered two more Chinese Splinters and my first Milaana 2 on the most recent sale. The value and performance of my RBT vapes are the best I've found to date.

    I own all the Chinese and custom Splinters and they work great. But while we wait half a year for Bud to get back to hand assembling the G43s again we're gonna criticize Ryan for a two month delay on the initial Milaana 3?

    The Splinter's modular 510 platform has been a great solution and like the XL8R dimpled cooling stems other vape makers are following suit. I mean how many years did Arizer have to think up a dimpled cooling stem on their own? Are their portables hand assembled in Canada by a team of craftsman?

    Are we forgetting the (Chinese manufactured) MV1 that came so highly recommended from the Vape Critic himself only to be plagued to this day by broken latches, peeling finishes, and software issues while it still cost $300 right up until the BF sale last year? Ghost has also been charging forty bucks for their battery pack, which turns out to just be two 18650s glued shut in a plastic sled so they can charge you 5x the cost of the cells.

    Or lets compare the Splinter heaters to the Tetra, Timber or Tinymight. Would you rather pay $250 and wait six to eight weeks for a batch drop on a convection portable made in a one man shop or would you rather pay $60 and put a Splinter on whatever mod suits your needs for battery life, firmware support, ergos, etc? Why is it okay for all three of those companies to offer pre-orders but it's bad business when RBT does it for an initial run of a new device?

    Oh and these 30 and 50% sales included the custom Milaana 2 and Splinter Zs too don't forget. I can sell my RBT vapes for a profit a year later yet I'm here listening to people talk about Ryan like he's ripping someone off. Which part of affordable and effective do we not like? If the ground glass joint is too fragile for your needs then get a Glow I guess?

    I can see vgoodies being peeved because retailers have a different set of headaches and the margins are slim. As a customer I can't complain.
  • martinstraka8282
    472
    My unsolicited opinion... this is the consequence of relatively poor customer service in comparison to a lot of the competition and what's perceived as changing stories as the delays go along.

    The products are obviously not the primary issue and criticism. The products themselves typically seem to be heralded other than some material issues with the cheaper Chinese manufacturing. Some of these other companies that had issues like you've outlined, survived by offering above and beyond customer service and communication to leave enough of the masses satisfied and not sully their name. Products like the G43 were very clearly going to take a long time from the get go and that was communicated. There is danger in over promising and under delivering.
  • Hapo
    245


    ...you fuking fuk, it is completelyy unfair and inappropriate to compare Bud's situation with the G43 to the ongoing cluster fuk that is RBT...

    ...for one thing Bud has no one's $$$...

    ...you might miss out but you won't get ripped off...
  • boze
    11
    I did solicit this opinion and I think it's a good point. Customer service is generally better from companies with staff. I had one glass joint break during the 30 period and I got good customer service from vgoodies. A year later I had another break on a new V2 and got a replacement in two weeks from Cole. I've owned maybe a dozen Splinters and set up several happy (tree) friends so don't own as many as I've bought.

    When I was still watching the Instagram streams I took a shine to the original thick XL8R stems and Ryan just sent me one as a thanks for the support. I since found another used and still have them.

    And yeah, I've stayed away from Ghost because their approach doesn't appeal to me, so different strokes for different folks I guess.
  • BestBuds
    2k
    I used to think the way you did. Just give it time I guess.

    He has worked hard for my mistrust in him. I (a former big fan) will not support him anymore and I will continue to warn others of the inadequacies of Ryans business acumen.
  • martinstraka8282
    472
    Haha I guess you did, I just felt like mine is unsolicited because I'm not really drawn to this product line myself and have only followed the store & story over the years through forums. I have no first hand experience with buying from these guys.

    It sounds like you had a good experience with them on the point I made, so from your perspective, it's surely not an issue.

    I have dealt with a few one man type operation vape companies on purchases and warranties otherwise and while they are slower to respond, it has been mostly a non issue. One thing I've noticed is that there has certainly been pleas to stay patient and some communication of their hardships and circumstances. I feel some empathy, but in the context of being a consumer, I just want to be taken care of as I expect and don't need sob stories that might guilt me from pushing when they say screw up a price slightly or charge shipping when they weren't supposed to, etc. Some of the communication can be a bit spotty and wacky when there's not set policies like a bigger company I guess is what I'm saying and that falls to your different strokes comment.

    You are absolutely right on different strokes for different folks. What one may consider good customer service, another may not. Sometimes one bad experience is all it can take. I like what Ghost does for their customers individually, but I am not a huge fan of their relatively guarded nature on forums, etc. i public communication.
  • The Rogue Wax Works
    1.2k
    @boze so much can be forgiven if you man up, be transparent and throw yourself on the mercy of your customers. IMO Ryan has done none of this.
  • Bud
    15.2k
    jii9rgr4mro639bj.png

    lol, jk, freedom of speech upheld, carry on...
  • SouthboundPachyderm
    2.4k
    what about the zion m preorder those units have been paid for for well over 6 months, and no production on them has even started. clearly you have had a good experience with RBT, but there are many others that have not.
  • Pud
    576
    "RBT designs and manufactures hand-crafted wooden vaporizers using a unique blend of high performance and organic style."... this is disingenuous to me... how is something thats made in a factory by machines "handcrafted"? I'd never buy something from anyone who starts off their "about me" like this. And how many years have they been manufacturing vapes?
  • boze
    11
    yeah, those are good points too and I'm not arguing that Ryan is an awesome business man or prompt at resolving customer service complaints. I'm more just looking at the landscape having owned more than a dozen other vapes apart from the stable of Splinters. I took part in the Fierce pre-order and had to return mine for a firmware update but still sold my Fury 2 to get an Edge a year after the Fierce dropped. Yes that was a hassle and yes it's made in China and yes their business features an office and staff. HealthyRips prices are still forcing lazy older companies like Arizer to lower prices on their stale portables.

    In the other direction I see the one man tinker types like Ralph at Lamart and Mike at Vapwood, both of whom I've bought from. More power to them for all the solo woodworking if that's how they want to build. But it's not like their $250 devices don't have defects and never break or fail. And it's not like I'm hearing back within a week if I email them necessarily, which I think is perfectly understandable given the demands on their time.

    Bigger picture I see Ryan as being one of the early pioneers of the large surface area on demand convection heater. They were initially built into a block of wood as a DIY path of least resistance. Then with the Splinter came the innovation that you can adapt a large surface area heater to fit a box mod like an ecig rda. After that came the move to Chinese manufacturing as a practical way to scale up and let Ryan focus on designing and improving affordable products rather than hand assembly and repairs. He was super up front about that as it went down, emailing customers and asking folks on the Instagram streams what they preferred.

    I agree that the attempt to stock an early 510 dry herb vape at retailers was ill-fated but I can totally see why you'd give it a shot. It's not like Ryan wants his job to be fulfillment like one of those reboxing Amazon centers you read about. And it's not like Puffitup and Sneaky Pete are selling lots of Stempods and Impcognitos.

    Are we saying we'd be happier with only an option to pay $180 for a custom Splinter Z and only if Ryan decides to stay in a shop week to week and replace any glass joints that break over the life of the unit? Folks gush about the Mighty readily enough and how much does S&B still charge to even swap out the battery for that $350 dinosaur?

    I'm just now learning about the Zion pre-order. I never understood why someone would want one of them after the same big heater evolved into the Splinter Z for a third of the price. I do think everyone who paid should get what they paid for and I understand the added pressure compared to Bud who took nobodies money and only made a verbal commitment to eventually get a G43 made for those of us on the list that closed last summer. I remember suggesting at that time that Bud might talk to Ryan about outsourcing manufacturing like he did. It seems like a double standard and like we're blaming someone for trying to bring cool products to market.
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